Petition Papers and Name Papers Questions and Answers

sephirah · Unread post by **sephirah** » Wed Feb 04, 2009 5:31 am

My question is regarding the re-use of writing tools and inscribing tools for peition papers and inscribing or dressing candles.

I use an old fat black bridge pencil to write my petitions. I do not wipe it down between work which would seem appropriate to do along with the other nondisposable "re-useable" tools (i.e. candle holders, knitting needles, screwdrivers etc. which would have residue on them).

A coffin nail to carve a candle would have that candle's residue on it. Would I want to use a nail used on a previous black candle to carve a red love candle? Or is it just a neutral writing tool, like a pencil, that carries no intent with it from spell to spell?

Standing by with salt and sage,
Marion Wethington (G)
#727

Dr Johannes · Unread post by **Dr Johannes** » Wed Feb 04, 2009 7:54 am

Hello Marion,

This may vary from practitioner to practitioner. Some might feel it is important to have clean tools for each new work, while some keep them as they are thinking each work will add strenght to the tool and some does not even think that such things are of importance at all for the effect of the spell.

Some may say it is important to pray over a new tool, to bless it and then cleanse it between each job (without thinking that the original blessing is washed off in any way, but remains with the tool).

Personally I cleanse my nails with a dry cloth or running water or a dash of ammonia.

Don´t use cold water or incense etc if you are using a coffin nail because this may cut off the spirit attached to it.

Use a dry cloth to wipe it off and a dash of whiskey to keep the spirit strong, between each work. Its also a good idea to take them out to the graveyard and leave them stuck in the ground there over night to recharge them once a year or so (Depending on how much work you do with them).

I advise you to decide for yourself which will feel most sincere and "right" for you, and stick to it.

Johannes Gardback, GGA.

Leah Rivera · Unread post by **Leah Rivera** » Wed Feb 04, 2009 8:31 am

Hello Marion,

I also reuse a lot of my tools, including those I write with. I just wipe them down with Florida Water before each one.

Lara

catherineyronwode · Unread post by **catherineyronwode** » Wed Feb 04, 2009 5:21 pm

When writing petitions, i often use what comes to hand, but i prefer one type of pen (a Pilot Razor Point, formerly a Niji Stylist) and i use that in preference to others. If i cannot grab one to hand, i next prefer a pencil. I will always choose a Pilot Razor Point or a pencil over a ballpoint pen. There is no "meaning" or "tradition" to this. It's just my preference. I do not clean or otherwise fuss over my writing tool between petitions.

As i mentioned in a reply on candle dressing, i have used the same tool for dressing candles for decades. It is an old, wood-handled iron screwdriver. I wash it down with Hoyt's cologne. I have also cleansed it with my own spit and oiled the wooden portion repeatedly with Van Van Oil. Over the years it has required some repair and tightening up of the ferrule that protects the wood-metal juncture. It is my pleasure and duty to keep this tool always polished, clean, dry, and in servicable condition.

Miss Bri · Unread post by **Miss Bri** » Fri Feb 06, 2009 7:31 am

I use a little vintage pocket knife given to me by my uncle to inscribe and dress candles. He gives me a knife every year for Christmas and one year he gave me a small one that is antler handled and fits in my hand perfectly. Before that I had used whatever came to hand, but once I got my knife I found that I had a strong preference for it. I keep it anointed with Holy Oil. I fiddle with candles when they aren't going the way I want them to, but like miss cat said, if I do that then I admit to myself that I can't get a good read off of them.

Bri

sephirah · Unread post by **sephirah** » Sun Feb 22, 2009 9:38 pm

Every single reply post is right on the mark and exactly the insight I was looking for. I am much more at peace with the subject and recognize the importance of these tools as being a sacred extention of my skills and intent, worthy of reverence, and rightfully deserve a special storage place of their own between implimentation. That place will now be in a box on my ancestor atlar, among those I call upon for guidance. I particularly like the idea of recharging coffon nails in a grave of someone either familiar with the practice or a family member whose allegiance to their descendants is unquestionable. Thank you Johannes for that.

Because I am still not comfortable with burning candle intervention, I may experiment with "grooming" the free standing candle before it actually becomes an official "work in progress", perhaps more bullet or pencil shaping the wick end to eliminate the well perimeter which puddles the liquid wax. It may be considered tampering nonetheless, but given enough time I might be able to come up with an hypothesis.

Marion Wethington (G)
#727

chatocamacho · Unread post by **chatocamacho** » Sun Feb 22, 2009 10:20 pm

Hi, I am getting ready to do a spell to bless someone and I was wondering what sort of tool I should use to inscribe a candle. I was thinking of using a rusty nail but then I read that, that is usually used for doing evil work, so I just want to know if I could use a pin or knife?

[Moderator shifted this topic from the Help With Spellcasting to Altar Tools: Writing Carving thread.]

J Simulcik · Unread post by **J Simulcik** » Sun Feb 22, 2009 11:49 pm

Sure you can. I prefer something like an awl because it's a bit more substantial than a pin, but still pointed. I have used a knife when that was all that I had on hand, but the height of the blade makes it harder to control. (Height as in sharp edge to opposite edge)

Lukianos · Unread post by **Lukianos** » Tue Feb 24, 2009 7:13 pm

I often use clean, shiny nails for inscribing candles for positive work. Needles (especially in the larger gauges) are also a good option. Fine razor-edged tools (ie: X-acto knives) can also be used, although those begin to have some of the same problems as standard knives on smaller candles.

Literarylioness · Unread post by **Literarylioness** » Tue Feb 24, 2009 7:28 pm

I use an 18k Italian gold earring for inscribing names and petitions into the wax of candles for all my positive work. I use a rusted coffin nail for all my negative work.

Mary

chatocamacho · Unread post by **chatocamacho** » Wed Mar 04, 2009 9:53 am

Hi, I was reading the book that catherine yronwode wrote, which by the way I love. I had a quck question for her or for anyone who can help me with this. In the spell it says:

"Write your name and his name in pieces of paper, pin the papers face to face and put them into a pint jar of water with a spoonful of sugar or honey and a handful of orange flowers. Close the jar and sorround it with five red candles dressed with attraction oil. Burn all the candles at once calling the man's name aloud as you light each one. Let the jar sit for five days, then take the name papers out, bury them in your back yard, and dress the spot with the left-over sweet water and your own urine."

My question is, what spot is she referring to?

Turnsteel · Unread post by **Turnsteel** » Wed Mar 04, 2009 10:03 am

I'm gonna say the spot you buried the name papers at.

Miss Bri · Unread post by **Miss Bri** » Wed Mar 04, 2009 10:11 am

I think HailDiscordia got it, its the spot where you buried the name papers in your back yard.
Bri

sahjia · Unread post by **sahjia** » Fri Mar 06, 2009 11:40 am

hello every one can i use the same writing tool, place, room for a dark work or love work or has to be diffrent?

carolina_dean · Unread post by **carolina_dean** » Fri Mar 06, 2009 8:45 pm

I'm originally from the South (South Carolina) and I LOVE my sweet tea. Every time I open a new bag of sugar I save the bag. These sugar bags are actually two bags, an outer bag and an inner bag. The outer bag has the brand name, UPC, etc...on it; but the inner bag is just a simple brown paper sack. I remove the inner bag from the outer bag, discard the outer bag and flatten it out for use later.

Whenever I do any type of sweetner spell, such as a honey jar, or love spell this is the paper I use to write my petitions on. I even hand drew one of the pentacles of venus on this paper and had great success with it as a talisman. I figure the paper's close proximity with the sugar gives it a little extra ooomph!

carolina dean

catherineyronwode · Unread post by **catherineyronwode** » Fri Mar 06, 2009 9:10 pm

Carolina Dean,

That is cool! Thanks for sharing!

=====

sahjia,

Read this thread -- some people work one way, some another. See also the thread on altars:
altars-questions-and-answers-t124.html

carolina_dean · Unread post by **carolina_dean** » Fri Mar 06, 2009 9:26 pm

thanks, just doing my part to give back a little.....

carolina dean

EcleckticMama · Unread post by **EcleckticMama** » Sat Mar 07, 2009 7:27 pm

Thank you so much for this idea, carolina dean. So few merchants around me use brown paper bags any more that it's not easy to come by. The inner bag of the sugar is lighter weight paper than kraft paper or a grocery sack too. (I use a lot of sugar for sweet tea, myself.

)

carolina_dean · Unread post by **carolina_dean** » Sat Mar 07, 2009 10:30 pm

I know what you mean. Up here where I am, they're talking about charging people to bag their groceries in plastic bags now. I even save the paper bags my fast food comes in and try to use pieces without any writing/advertising on it.

carolina dean

Miss Bri · Unread post by **Miss Bri** » Sun Mar 08, 2009 7:16 am

This is so smart! And not wasteful! I love it. Thanks

Bri

Amanda · Unread post by **Amanda** » Mon Mar 09, 2009 6:48 pm

On a related note, I am curious to know why paper from a brown paper bag is most often used as a substitute for the traditional parchment paper for petitions and such in the hoodoo practice. I think I read somewhere on the Lucky Mojo site that practitioners would sometimes use paper that would match the skin tone of those involved in their conjuring (relating to the honey jar spells). Does this tradition stem from that same idea? Being that hoodoo evolved from the African-American communities it stands to reason they would use a readily available and relatively cheap source of paper that matches the skin tone of the majority of the clientele/practitioners. Or is there another reason that I'm not aware of? My curious anthropologist mind wants to know...

EcleckticMama · Unread post by **EcleckticMama** » Mon Mar 09, 2009 8:10 pm

My amateur anthropologist analysis sees it this way:

True parchment is created from calf skins and a rather involved process goes into making it, thus it's rather expensive.

Brown paper, such as would have been used to wrap goods bought from a drygoods store would have been readily available as a source of paper to slaves and servants (such as may have wrapped a processed sugar cone or other rations provided) unlike white writing paper which would not have been considered a necessary item. Just as the Southern style red flannel mojo back most likely came about because scraps from making underwear from the allotted red flannel were readily available (in addition to the red associations with the African religions). Miss cat talks about that somewhere here in this wonderful site.

Funny you should word it as brown paper as a substitute for parchment when the wikipedia article says that parchment was developed as substitute to papyrus (a tan "paper"). So perhaps the tradition of paper for spell work is actually much older.

chatocamacho · Unread post by **chatocamacho** » Wed Mar 11, 2009 8:12 am

Hi, I was just wondering,, when you are doing candle magic, would you burn the name papers and pictures of the one you were doing the spell for?

Leah Rivera · Unread post by **Leah Rivera** » Wed Mar 11, 2009 11:21 am

That completely depends for me on the type of work, the feel of the work and the type of candle magic. I can't go into full details, but can give you some examples of when I do burn the papers or pictures.

In a cut and clear, I will burn the picture of the person my client is wishing to rid themselves of.
In court case work, I have burned copies of the legal papers as part of the work.
In crossing work, I have burned the person's picture.
In blessing work, I have burned the petitions when I felt moved to.

Lara

Sharona22 · Unread post by **Sharona22** » Fri Mar 13, 2009 8:02 am

I know you can not explain every instance but when I am putting the picture back to back with my petition also a sachet dusted seal should I burn the picture and petition if I am doing pyschic vision spell for animal communication. If there is an opinion out there?

Apo · Unread post by **Apo** » Fri Mar 13, 2009 5:59 pm

I have noticed some spells ask for the conjurer to rip the corners of the paper or trim them, while others don't require it so.

What's the symbolism/logic behind this practice? and what spell are this practice recommended for?

Thanks.

Lukianos · Unread post by **Lukianos** » Fri Mar 13, 2009 9:12 pm

Hi Sharona22,

I cannot think of any reason that you would need to burn your picture or petition as part of the psychic vision work you described.

bubba · Unread post by **bubba** » Sat Mar 14, 2009 2:14 am

Hi guys

Im a very authentic person and i beleive authentic ingredients should be used as much and best as possible, but if u cannot afford it then yes u should go ahead and substitute, i was wondering from where i could buy parchment?

And its intrsting that Carolin used the venus pentacle, would u be able to describe where we would use that exactly on a petition paper? and even if it would be a good idea to put other symbols such as star signs etc,,for addedd strenghth....and would there be possible other uses for the venus pentacle ...as u mentioned..i would like to kno of your tried methods..

Thank u Bubba

J Simulcik · Unread post by **J Simulcik** » Sat Mar 14, 2009 5:18 am

Much of the time, it's either how the practitioner was taught or how they choose to practice. Beyond that, I'm unaware of the origin of torn sides. Hopefully someone else knows more.

carolina_dean · Unread post by **carolina_dean** » Sat Mar 14, 2009 5:44 am

Thanks for your interest bubba, but as I'm given to understand this board has been created for the exclusive discussion of traditional conjure and how to use Lucky Mojo products, my answer would not be appropriate here as this incident occurred 8 years ago and I used a method not associated with Hoodoo.

carolina dean

Turnsteel · Unread post by **Turnsteel** » Sat Mar 14, 2009 8:09 am

I always thought some people tore the sides of the paper they used so it wouldn't have machine cut edges, always seemed kinda silly to me but I still do it on occasion when I feel moved to.

Literarylioness · Unread post by **Literarylioness** » Sat Mar 14, 2009 2:44 pm

I only burn pictures or petitions when I am trying to get rid of someone or thing. Since you are trying to attain something, I would not burn the petition or photo.

Mary

Sharona22 · Unread post by **Sharona22** » Sun Mar 15, 2009 10:35 am

Thanks, I will remember this

Leah Rivera · Unread post by **Leah Rivera** » Sun Mar 15, 2009 12:27 pm

Yes there is a tradition for both when to tear the edges and when to cut the edges.

Edges are torn in blessing, wishing, love and other drawing work. The purposes of tearing the paper is so that it is "so pure that the angels could read it or write on it".

Cut edges are used in cursing, break up and hot foot work, traditionally on a three sided peice of paper (triangle) to make the points sharp, continuing on the theme of pins, needles and nails.

Lara

Apo · Unread post by **Apo** » Sun Mar 15, 2009 1:40 pm

Thank you Lara

I was wondering the use. And pardon my ignorance bot how is tearing the sides associated with purity?

Literarylioness · Unread post by **Literarylioness** » Sun Mar 15, 2009 2:41 pm

From another thread...

Sharona wroteWhen I write my petition on paper to put it under my Pyschic Vision candle what are the items to write with -- anything specific? I am doing the spell kit, but I also as everyone knows by now probably burning a 7 day glass Pyschic Vision dressed candle from LM (they also burnt one at Missionary Independent Spiritual Church). I am putting my own things under the candle and burning it by a statue of St. Francis. Thanks

There are a few ways to do this.

I was taught to write with a red pen or a pencil without an eraser, when you want something. Those small pencils in libraries work wonders.

When you are trying to curse someone, do revenge, or get rid of someone, or thing, you use a black pen.

Hope that helps,

Mary

Clarabella · Unread post by **Clarabella** » Mon Mar 16, 2009 6:39 am

Well, I've learned to (mostly) control my embarrassment at asking for answers that may be obvious to everyone but myself. Thanking you ahead of time for your patience. This relates somewhat to another discussion about burning petition papers, and the answer to my question may have been implied but I'd like to know for sure.

In my reading of everything hoodoo-related on the web, I know I've come across people stating that their petition papers caught on fire. I was kind of taken aback, because I assumed this could only happen if the paper was actually inside the container that held the candle, and underneath the candle itself. This made me wonder if I'd made a stupid error all along in assuming that "under the candle" meant under the container the candle was in. I'd always, thus far, burnt my candles atop an overturned saucer or metal dish, with the petition paper under the saucer. Is this the correct way to burn the candle atop the petition, or have I been making a mistake?

Miss Bri · Unread post by **Miss Bri** » Mon Mar 16, 2009 8:10 am

HI Clarabella,

The way that you describe placing your petition paper sounds just fine to me. Some people do burn candles right on top of petition papers or photographs and depending on the work that you are doing that can be very effective. I have done that, I have also placed petition papers/photos under the candle holder that I am burning my candle in, similar to what you describe- either way is fine. Some people will also load their petition paper or photo into the bottom of the candle a long with roots, herbs, and personal concerns. If you are using vigil lights you can place petition papers underneath them or tape them to the sides.

take care,
Bri

Clarabella · Unread post by **Clarabella** » Mon Mar 16, 2009 8:50 am

Bri

Are there any guidelines to indicate how you would decide which kind of work would be better off with the paper in with the candle, as opposed to underneath? Or do you just let your intuition guide you? In practical terms, because lights are sometimes burning when I'm not here, I'm also concerned with a paper catching fire and flaming up, possibly setting off the smoke alarm and bringing other unwanted aftereffects.

Sharona22 · Unread post by **Sharona22** » Mon Mar 16, 2009 11:42 am

As for my pyschic vision dressed candle I am getting from LM I am putting my seal dressed with power sachet under the candle I am going to tape petition back to back with a picture of my dog and I I do not know whether to put this under candle or tape it to front I also bought 2 St francis pet medals I am putting one on my dogs collar one by the candle and after it finishes burning I am going to wear it,what do you think

Sharona22 · Unread post by **Sharona22** » Mon Mar 16, 2009 11:54 am

The pencil and pen info helps Thanks I just bought red pen

bubba · Unread post by **bubba** » Mon Mar 16, 2009 1:37 pm

Hi guys and gals

I wanted to ask when u doing breakup or cast off work etc..and u dont kno who is influencing the person of concern then what to inscribe on the petition paper or bottle or candle etc..

And would 1 candle be sufficient for a group of freinds for example or a group of lovers or family members...

How would one do work successfully without knowing how many and who is influencing the subject...

Thank u

bubba

love out

snake · Unread post by **snake** » Mon Mar 16, 2009 3:40 pm

I never put my petition paper in the candle. I'm just so paranoid about things catching fire. It has happened to me before, and I don't want to cause any possible problems. Recently I've started writing directly on the jar candle with a sharpie. I don't know if that's proper and I know sharpies aren't exactly traditional. If the candle is a votive or figural or something I just put the paper under the candle holder.

Literarylioness · Unread post by **Literarylioness** » Mon Mar 16, 2009 3:50 pm

If it is a glass enclosed vigil candle, the paper is taped to the bottom. If the vigil candle is ongoing, the paper gets taped under each candle. I have papers that are over 20 years old, because I started the vigil candles in high school!

If it is a free standing candle, the paper can be put under it. Usually the paper does not catch fire, but gets covered in wax and gets a proper burial.

I hope that answers a few questions.

Mary

catherineyronwode · Unread post by **catherineyronwode** » Mon Mar 16, 2009 5:11 pm

I have been known to peel the green felt bottoms off of brass candlesticks, tape petitions in the deep hollow space underneath, re-glue the green felt on the bottom and leave the petitions there for years.

Also, i have seen petitions that were taped to the OUTSIDE of a glass vigil light or novena candle char, smoke, and sizzle a bit; and ditto for the paper labels on such candles.

Always respect the power of fire.

catherineyronwode · Unread post by **catherineyronwode** » Mon Mar 16, 2009 5:33 pm

When using paper bag paper -- which is more traditional in hoodoo than the use of parchment or parchment-like paper -- one side (the edge of the bag) will be machine cut, so all four sides are torn to make them equally "pure" -- free of the machine edge. Tearing in straight lines is a conscious, careful act and focusses the mind.

Cutting with metal scissors, a knife, or pinking shears evokes forms of warlike separation and banishment.

snake · Unread post by **snake** » Mon Mar 16, 2009 5:41 pm

This is wonderful information! I've been using just random pieces of paper and whatever pen is convenient. I'd really like to get some nice parchment and a pretty quill pen. Maybe with next month's LM order.

catherineyronwode · Unread post by **catherineyronwode** » Mon Mar 16, 2009 5:51 pm

Another custom is, when you seek to dominate a lover And here's another avriation: and make them love you, write their name several times (3, 7, or 9 times) with black ink, then cross and cover that with your name or your command "Love Me") written the same number of times in red ink, so they will "look up and see love."

And here's another variation: To get someone out of your life, write their name 3, 7, or 9 times in pencil, then cross over it the same number of times with your command in black ink, such as "Leave Town!" and then ERASE their pencilled names.

People also have asked me "which version" of a name to use, especially in the case of a married woman.

In the case of a married woman:
The full birth name is: first-name, middle-name, maiden-surname.
The full current legal name is: first-name, middle-name, married-surname.
The cumulative full name is: first-name, middle-name, maiden-surname, married-surname.

See more by me on this subject here:

personal-concerns-hair,-photo,-name-que ... tml#p76763

Good luck!

Apo · Unread post by **Apo** » Mon Mar 16, 2009 6:46 pm

Thank you very much Cat. Now I understand.

Sharona22 · Unread post by **Sharona22** » Mon Mar 16, 2009 7:08 pm

Anything that is of significant when writting a petition asking for something with the pyschic vision kit like writting your name any certain amount of times etc.? m I want to wait to start both my pyschic vision candle spell kit and john the conquer mojo hand and candle till the waxing moon so question when is the new moon?ddddDoes the waxing moon start the next day after the new moon?

Literarylioness · Unread post by **Literarylioness** » Mon Mar 16, 2009 9:01 pm

Sharona22

The waxing moon starts after the new moon. Here is a link to moon phases: http://www.calculatorcat.com/moon_phase ... ases.phtml

Mary

Brujero05 · Unread post by **Brujero05** » Thu Mar 19, 2009 11:05 pm

Burning namepapers or petitions is akin to banishment Hoodoo. However, in other traditions burning petitions may be so the smoke "sends the message to the Heavens." For example, the Chinese burn paper money as offering to their Gods.

Literarylioness · Unread post by **Literarylioness** » Thu Mar 19, 2009 11:36 pm

bubba

I would word it "I banish whoever, or whatever comes between me and (name of target)." That covers anyone who gets in the way.

Mary

J Simulcik · Unread post by **J Simulcik** » Fri Mar 20, 2009 8:11 am

Brujero05

Burning or scattering joss paper is common in Chinese Taoism, but not Buddhism. Depending on the area, as well, (China's rather large) joss may be offered to one's ancestors, local deities, major deities, or a combination of these. "Hell" Bank Notes are just a more modern form of offering. In addition to cash, many items are offered made of joss that families may give to their ancestors. Although some in China's Department of Civil Affairs have spoken out against such items, it is still possible to find made from joss MP3 players, cars, planes, and other modern symbols of wealth and well-being. It will be interesting to see how that plays out politically.

Anyway, to bring this discussion back around, the burning of joss paper and the burning of name papers have no relation to one another except for the process of combustion. They developed separately and are used for different reasons.

Malefic · Unread post by **Malefic** » Sun Mar 22, 2009 7:10 pm

With the glass candles, I usually burn the candle with the paper underneath. Then when the candle burns out, I put the paper inside and fill the whole thing with boiling water to melt away any wax residue, then I take it to my yard or the crossroads (whatever seems best for the type of spell) and pour out the water, dissolved wax/herb remains, and the soggy paper there.

Literarylioness · Unread post by **Literarylioness** » Sun Mar 22, 2009 7:31 pm

Malefic

Hey, that's pretty cool! I like your idea Malefic.

Mary

Yelena · Unread post by **Yelena** » Mon Mar 23, 2009 9:48 am

Cat is right, this happens somewhat regularly at the Missionary Independent Spiritual Church (http://www.missionary-independent.org/). For this reason it is a good idea to keep a careful watch of how the candle is progressing regardless of where the petition is placed. Also, what happens to the petition during the burn can be very significant in reading the outcome of your burn.

lovebird · Unread post by **lovebird** » Sat Apr 04, 2009 1:43 pm

Hi,
I had 2 vigil candles that just went out on Friday. They were Attraction & Lucky Buddah. They burned clean and clear no wax left over. I took my petition and burned them was that ok?

Thanks,
Mzcee

Miss Bri · Unread post by **Miss Bri** » Sat Apr 04, 2009 2:24 pm

Burning petition papers that you are not going to re-use is a pretty standard form of disposal.

take care,
Bri

lovebird · Unread post by **lovebird** » Sat Apr 04, 2009 2:47 pm

Hi Bri,
Thank you so much I was worried.

Mzcee